Posts by Rod P

I think all of the Sacred Texts from many diverse sources are written by men, with many different personalities and viewpoints, but that the writers were "spiritually minded". But thru it all, there was a spark of Divinity peaking thru and entwined within, revealing spiritual truths and principles and concepts that would lead us to God, if we followed the Spiritual Path.

So yes, God let the writers say what they wanted, describe events and situations, and they could even be fallible and contradictory in some of their "comments". Yet there in the midst of it all was the indelible stamp of Divinity.

Now there is an awful lot of stuff in the Old Testament that strikes me as pretty nasty and mean, and the antithesis of the spiritual. And I don't know how much of it was all borrowed from somewhere else (eg. Adam and Eve, the Flood, etc.), but I'm pretty sure there was a lot of it in that category. But thru the pages of the Bible are a lot of spiritual principles that are inspired or "God-breathed". It's like God trying to get thru to us with our thick skulls when we don't even want to listen. (Free Will, and all that.) My search is to find what is and what is not "spiritually valid", in spite of Man, and not because of him. That is why I do not think my search is limited to the Bible, because the God of the Universe is for all mankind, and not just for a chosen few of one race or colour or creed.

Rod P.

66

Does the Bible interpret itself, or a fiddle you can play any tune with?

by Rod P in

jw
friends

testing this thread.

well, after three times, it finally worked.

why are there so many religions all professing belief in the bible, yet all of them interpret the bible differently?

Rod P

Gumby,

Wrong answer! Now go to the Principul's Office and explain why you choose not to pay attention. You know where it's at- just down the hall and up the elevator, and stop on the 5000th floor. Look for the door with the big, illuminated "J.C.: on the front.

Anyway you know better than to akuse the teach' of bein' a, what was it yu said..."non-spiritual heathen". Now I don't mind bein' called a "heathen" cuz all that means is someone who comes from the "heath" or the countryside. But to call me "non-spiritual", that's just plain nasty and vindictive. Now for that, I'm gonna wash yur mouth out with spiritual soap, and get rid of all that foul garbage that's in there.

And the next time I catch ya readin' one of them Apostate magazines, feedin' yur head with all that nonsense, I'm gonn make ya write 5000 lines: "I will not read apostate magazines in class." Damn, Gumby, it's no wonder J.C. yanked you outta that Sunday School ministry. I told Him you couldn't handle it, and then we'd have to go into damage control for all those wrong teachings you keep spreading around. Oh those poor, innocent believers! I just hope it's not too late!

Rod P.

66

Does the Bible interpret itself, or a fiddle you can play any tune with?

by Rod P in

jw
friends

testing this thread.

well, after three times, it finally worked.

why are there so many religions all professing belief in the bible, yet all of them interpret the bible differently?

Rod P

Little Toe,

Orange yu funny.

But yur wrong. Yes, there are cookies in Heaven. These ones are good for you, becuz they are Spiritual Cookies which have higher vibrations without all that nasty sugar, and you get rewarded with one every time you learn another Spiritual Concept. On the outside of each cookie it says "Eat me!" Can't say whether it makes you grow bigger or smaller though! It works differently for each individual. Guess you'll just have to try one and find out. LOL

Rod P.

38

When you see a JW or two on the street, do you ignore them or speak tothem?

by Rod P in

jw
friends

most of the time i just walk on by.

i just can't be bothered, and they are not going to believe what i say anyway.

besides, should i tell them i am disfellowshipped, which may scare them away?

Rod P

Terry,

That response is the best I've ever heard. Should work good on Mormons as well! Mind if I steal it too?

Do you folks see that there's a Catch-22 here (if you talk to them, that is.) Because you know so much about them and what they have been taught to believe, etc. You know what to say to them. So if you discuss some of their teachings or issues, it becomes readily apparent to them that you are not just some ordinary "householder" walking down the street. You know the lingo, the logic, the scriptures. This would make them suspicious that you are probably a former JW, which would make them uncomfortable, and probably ask you if you are disfellowshipped. Not that that is a problem for you, but it is a problem for them, because now they would realize they have been talking to an apostate, albeit innocently. (...Shudder) This may then leave them with a bad taste in their mouth, feeling that you had deceived them, just like Satan tries to do. In other words, the very act of talking to them may actually become a stumbling block for them to consider an alternative to their religion, because now they have their defenses up.

Rod P.

66

Does the Bible interpret itself, or a fiddle you can play any tune with?

by Rod P in

jw
friends

testing this thread.

well, after three times, it finally worked.

why are there so many religions all professing belief in the bible, yet all of them interpret the bible differently?

Rod P

Gumby,

If yur gonna akuse me of sumpin', den at leest get yer faks strait. Now pay attention, Gumby, cuz I'm gonna gib ya a test, and I want ya ta skore bedder dan 90%!

Obviously, you didn't pay attention to Luke 17:20-21:

So for the hard of hearing, here it is agin:

And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the Kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said (Jesus speaking), The Kingdom of God cometh not with observations. Neither shall they say, Lo here, or, Lo there! for behold, the Kingdom of God is within you.

Another thing Gumby, ol' Boy, who's the Apostate here? You or me?! Simple: Whose the believer and who ain't? So there, smarty pants!

Now Gumby, you have fallen into the trap of the literalists. You think the only possibility for a Kingdom just has to be physical. Can't see fur lookin'. Can't see past yur noze fur another angle. "Gee, God, where's that kingdom of yours? Oh der dey are, that bunch of peeple ober der. Tanks God fur showin' me yur Kingdum!"

"The Kingdom of God cometh not by observation." (Remember Luke?)

Don't ya see, Gumby, a bunch of peeple do not a Kingdum of God make. The thing about this particular bunch of People is that they are in tune with the Divine, from the inside. They get it! And you can too, but ya just gotta try. They are individually and collectively "in the Kingdom of God" from within. If you're trying to find it from "Outward appearances" then, of course, yur gonna be disappointed. "Lookin' for Love in all the wrong places," and all this time you didn't know it is right under (or should I say "in") your own nose. Maybe God's just being sneaky with us, playing spiritual Hide 'n Go Seek (er... Find).

Rod P.

46

Did you know that it is wrong to play Chess?

by Rod P in

jw
friends

i remember being at a bookstudy one tuesday night.

i had just recently been reinstated, and i was trying hard to believe the stuff the wbts was teaching, as i went back to be reunited with my family.

(this did not mean i had all the doctrinal beliefs straightened out so that i was an "automatic believer" just because of being reinstated.).

Rod P

Do you think that Chess Game computer programs, such as from super computers, have reached the point where even World Chess Champions can be beaten by them?

Have you played chess with a computer, and if so, what level did you get to?

Rod P.

53

If you won the Lottery big time, would you be happier?

by Rod P in

jw
friends

how many of us imagine winning the big one, and all our problems in life would be solved.

we could get whatever we wanted without worrying about money, could buy our way out of almost any situation (like the rich folks do), go on any vacation anywhere in the world, dress to the nines on a daily basis, and use our wealth to get others to do our bidding.. money = sex, power, influence, decadent luxury = happiness???.

rod p.

Rod P

Do any of you think buying Lottery Tickets is "Gambling" and therefore it is wrong to play the game? Do you think that Lottery Tickets are like Marijuana; they lead to serious gambling and drugs which results in addiction?

Personally, if it's kept within reason, I don't see the harm. And I don't think this leads to serious gambling, although there's always the exception.

Rod P.

66

Does the Bible interpret itself, or a fiddle you can play any tune with?

by Rod P in

jw
friends

testing this thread.

well, after three times, it finally worked.

why are there so many religions all professing belief in the bible, yet all of them interpret the bible differently?

Rod P

Gumby,

If you want me to point to some place on a map of this planet and say "This is where the Kingdom of God is." then the answer is, there is none. If you insist on the outward, physical form of the Kingdom of God, then I doubt you will find it. This is my big beef with you materialists. That's the only proof you will accept. And that's fine with me, if that's the way you see things, sobeit.

But for me, that's just not good enough. You ask for evidence where the Kingdom of God is. That is not the criterion used by Jesus. (Yeah, I know, He's all a myth to you as well.) I believe (Yes, I said the word "believe") that there is a Kingdom of God because so many Sacred Texts from around the world speak of this. Not just the Bible.

Now, for starters, what is meant by the Kingdom of God? I want to say to you that it is not a physical place or location. A better description would be that it is a "state of mind". It is an "attunement" or "at-one-ment with the Divine. Call it an "altered state of consciousness" or state of being, if you want.

Luke 17:20-21 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the "Kingdom of God" should come, he answered them and said, "The Kingdom of God cometh not with observations. Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, Lo there! for behold the Kingom of God is within you.

Gospel of Thomas- Saying 3 (Blatz):

Jesus said, If those who lead you say to you, see the Kingdom is in heaven, then the birds of heaven will go before you; If they say to you: It is in the Sea, then the fish will go before you. But the kingdom is within you, and it is outside of you. When you know yourselves, then you will be known and you will know that you are the sons of the living Father. But if you do not know yourselves, then you are in poverty, and you are poverty.

(Poverty means not knowing yourself. "God did not give us religion. We must find our own way." (John /Feth))

Eternal Salvation: By this I do not refer to Jesus' "ransom sacrifice", the shedding of his blood on the cross for the sins of mankind. There is an interesting debate around this subject, which says that this is a teaching that crept in later, and was not the original concept of Salvation.

Gospel of Thomas- Saying 70 (Blatz) - Jesus said: If you have gained this within you, what you have will save you. If you do not have this is you, what you do not have in you will kill you.

The Kingdom of God and Salvation is not an Objective Experience or concept. It is a Subjective one. You can only know it by experiencing it from within. The Materialist and the Skeptic will never know the Kingdom of God, because his very thinking acts as the barrier to exploring and experiencing it. He will simply go on denying the possibility that it exists. If I showed you testimony of those who have been there and in that state, you will deny that too! There is no "proof" that will convince the skeptic, because he is never satisfied. If there was, you'd probably turn the matter over to the Great Randi the Magician to see what trick he could conjur up, so that you could then say, "See, it's all just a trick." If God came down and whacked you over the head, you would probably say someone hit you accidentally with a golf ball, or some other "rationalization" because for you, the Spiritual is all myth. Therefore I say, "Let's simply agree to disagree! No harm done."

Rod P.

66

Does the Bible interpret itself, or a fiddle you can play any tune with?

by Rod P in

jw
friends

testing this thread.

well, after three times, it finally worked.

why are there so many religions all professing belief in the bible, yet all of them interpret the bible differently?

Rod P

Hi Gumby, nice to hear from you.

I think you have presented a good profile as to the expectations most people have about their sacred book, the Bible. If this is really God's Word, and it is inspired by Him, then He should protect it, and He should make it's meaning(s) clear for people from all the diverse eras of human history- past, present and future. And it should tell the truth, and all prophecies should come true as stated. It should also reveal God's will, teaching mankind truths that he could not know in and of himself.

Knowledge, science, medicine, politics, economics, etc. may advance over time, but human nature pretty much stays the same. Study some of the characters in the Old and New Testaments and we can readily recognize some of the age-old behaviours and motivations of people living in this day and age. Study Shakespeare, with his inciteful character analysis and studies, and we could just as easily tell the same stories for the same characters in the context of the 21st Century. In other words, another one of the high standards for sacred texts is that it must apply to the human race for all time periods and not just for 2000 years ago, or 5000 years ago, to the cultural flavour of the day.

Having said all that, I would further add that this is pretty much the standard that believers hold up for their Sacred Texts that are not the Bible. And so we have the Defenders of the Faith, the Apologists, the Scholars who make it their Mission in life to "prove" their Holy Book is inspired of God. Some make a thorough study of the history and culture of those times, while others focus on the ancient languages and hermeneutics and textual criticism in respect of the Bible, all of which they feel builds strength and hope in their faith that this is of God.

Enter the detractors, the skeptics, the atheists. They set about attempting to disprove everything in terms of the above claims, and the great debate is on, with them on one side, and the believers on the other. There are winners and losers on both sides, and so you will, observe, over time, individuals on one side or the other change their conclusions and cross over to the other side. But by and large, they pretty well stick to their own convictions, becoming more and more "sold" on the notion that they are right and the other side is wrong.

And so it is not surprising to me in the least that we are never going to find unanimity or consensus when it comes to the Sacred Scriptures around the World. Also, so much has been invested in time, expense and reputation that no-one is ready to give things up so easily. Many would defend their position to the death. "God is on our side." says the believer.

The skeptic and the atheist are equally intransigent in their viewpoint that only what you can see, hear, feel, taste or touch (and a few other things that scientfic instruments have detected along the way) will be accepted as valid. Everything else is myth, illusion, superstition or self-deception. They worship at the Altars of Science and Humanism, and are convinced this is the only logical alternative.

With all these colorful and varied viewpoints, perspectives, belief systems, attitudes, biases and predispositions, all intermingled with race, language, culture and nowadays scientific method, it is inevitable that the debates surrounding meaning and interpretation will rage on endlessly.

This is exactly why I do not buy the argument that any one religion is right, or that only one religion has the right interpretation of the Bible. And therefore, the question of our Eternal Salvation, IMO, cannot and does not rest on whether we accept the Bible as the Word of God, according to the interpretation of some Church or Religion.

Rather, I see the Bible, like many other Sacred Texts, as precursors, leading us on an individual and inward journey, and there we shall find the Kingdom of God. This is the world of Inner Truth and Light, that will take us beyond mere words. This is a world that will change the Mythical, the Theoretical, the Speculative and the Pseudo into the Mystical, the Spiritual, the Authentic where will be found Wisdom, Harmony and Love. These are not mere platitudes, but rather qualities to be experienced, not rationalized. Our brains need to get out of the way, so to speak, because our intellect at one point, actually stands in our way. Rather, we need to take the plunge into the Unknown, and just let it happen. "Be still, and know that I am God." That is my Mission and my Goal.

This is not my attempt to convert you to some kind of belief system. I am only telling you all that "For Me" this is where I am heading. You have to decided what's right for you.

Rod P.